tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.comments2022-07-17T14:39:06.546+02:00The Eclipse StudyMichaelahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08831566630451286674noreply@blogger.comBlogger22125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-51587221695958316772011-09-12T14:14:37.594+02:002011-09-12T14:14:37.594+02:00The GUI test is the most wildly use and its prope...The GUI test is the most wildly use and its properties is so powerfulsix sigma certification onlinehttp://www.brainmeasures.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-34640083649812337122011-08-24T12:03:31.690+02:002011-08-24T12:03:31.690+02:00thanks !!thanks !!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-38065898146286136362011-04-18T16:31:39.146+02:002011-04-18T16:31:39.146+02:00I did not find any source too (even any reference ...I did not find any source too (even any reference about it). Moreother I cannot make it work well. I have had several classes not found (about 6) and put a lot of time finding JARs (the support forum was helpful for only 2 of them). The best I have now is a test case which stopped at the beginning with a NullPointerException coming from the deepest parts of Window Tester itself (so I was looking for sources, but without any result).<br /><br />All of that on the official SWT sample. With the Swing sample I cannot generate any test : the record stops immediately after it starts.<br /><br />Quite a shame isn't it ? {-_-}mve@infologic.frnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-28845016486084334772011-03-13T22:34:52.867+01:002011-03-13T22:34:52.867+01:00I don't think Google open-sourced WindowTester...I don't think Google open-sourced WindowTester Pro.<br />http://code.google.com/javadevtools/eclipse-donation-faq.htmlAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-61901886273558657032011-02-18T17:01:32.872+01:002011-02-18T17:01:32.872+01:00> Also P11's team uses automated GUI tests....> Also P11's team uses automated GUI tests. He reports:<br />> “One thing that is really good is the extension of GEF<br />> for the SWT-Bot. It is hard to test a graphical editor.<br />> We can test them very easily, and we are very happy<br />> about that.“<br /><br />Glad they are happy with GEF extension for SWTBot :)Mariot Chauvinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06363398743120781633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-6435597393614880402011-02-16T16:02:19.890+01:002011-02-16T16:02:19.890+01:00I think a hybrid solution makes sense. The faster ...I think a hybrid solution makes sense. The faster and easier to write GUI tests the wider they will be used. <br /><br />From Human-Computer Interaction (HCI) point of view, if predictive human performance model logic in CogTool is added in SWT-BOT , we can also use these tests for performance needs and efficiency analysis.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-5403940803763532642011-02-16T15:20:50.175+01:002011-02-16T15:20:50.175+01:00Squish from Java from froglogic seems to be missin...Squish from Java from froglogic seems to be missing here. Certainly one of the most powerful GUI test tools I have ever used with true support for RCP testing and cross-platform is missing here...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-74973342999255819282010-12-30T07:49:15.369+01:002010-12-30T07:49:15.369+01:00I would say here that in open source programs no o...I would say here that in open source programs no one is responsible for the quality of the delivered product so it is something like common ownership, so if you exercise something and you get a bug there is no commitment or obligation to get this fixed as soon as you need!, in commercial products this is not the case you are committed to your customer to deliver a reliable product to the level which guarantee your customer satisfaction. another point I have here that if you teach the developer to not introduce a bug, I would say you can depend on their testing :)it is an old subject testing is not about writing test plan or define a long test process, testing is about tailor your practices to comply with your current requirement for a specific project and work cooperatively with developers to get the whole image and make them evolved as your development work changes , I would answer your talk about having tester writing a lot of meaningless test plan because in a lot of situation they do not have good visibility about how the tree has been grew up but the solution is not to give everything for the developers because definitely if they were aware that this step in growing up the tree may introduce another bug most properly they will not going to introduce them. so if I have more money and you are in critical situation you have to stop bleeding by invest more in testing, after that you can start from earlier phases, which always not mean to invest on developers.. it depends :) and really it depends on your case, if you have like a highly mature developers you may add more practices like static analysis for your code or traditional inspection and may be as you mentioned make the tester life more easier through tooling and get them more productive in the simple task so they will have more time to get closer to their customer usage profile, or just get your tester more earlier involved in the development phase...guys we left the waterfall models from years it is no more fitting the current high demands for quality with the fast time to market :)eman m.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-92038068132009033162010-12-14T12:54:57.912+01:002010-12-14T12:54:57.912+01:00It is a valid point to separate open source, comme...It is a valid point to separate open source, commercial and hybrid (commercial open source) projects. I simplified the categorization because out of all interviewed open source and commercial open source projects so far only two had dedicated testers. I am very interested in examples of commercial open source projects that do have testers. Could you mention some within the Eclipse community? I would like to interview them as well.<br /><br />In addition, why do you think you need/have a separated test team?Michaelahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08831566630451286674noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-42366721311972426672010-12-14T12:03:22.744+01:002010-12-14T12:03:22.744+01:00"Why do open source development teams not hav..."Why do open source development teams not have testers on their teams but commercial projects do?"<br />You are opposing open-source and commercial. IMHO, this is not a right way to view things. I am part of a team that develops a commercial open-source product, ie an open-source product which is intended to generate money to a company. We have testers for our open-source product, and I am aware of a lot of other open-source commercial products that also have teams dedicated to testing.Mickael Istriahttp://www.bonitasoft.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-53179471225456311272010-12-14T10:14:11.490+01:002010-12-14T10:14:11.490+01:00Hello Sung,
Thank you for raising this good point...Hello Sung,<br /><br />Thank you for raising this good point. We are, for example, analyzing the interviews according to “Test Challenges” Eclipsers face. Those challenges give potential for improvements and to facilitate testing and reach from tooling (like build and tests systems), to test processes and strategies. Another actionable item is spreading best practices. Many of the projects we interviewed are mature and have identified strategies other project could benefit from.<br /><br />MichaelaMichaelahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08831566630451286674noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-4821605659247813692010-12-08T07:38:27.993+01:002010-12-08T07:38:27.993+01:00Hi Michaela,
It's a very nice and interesting...Hi Michaela,<br /><br />It's a very nice and interesting study. Did you identify some actionable items from the survey results? How could we improve Eclipse testing?<br /><br />SungSung Kimhttp://www.cse.ust.hk/~hunkimnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-5392218426696746182010-12-07T20:26:10.711+01:002010-12-07T20:26:10.711+01:00Hey Marcel,
Thank you for the comment. Yes, we wi...Hey Marcel,<br /><br />Thank you for the comment. Yes, we will definitely provide more details on how Eclipsers develop software, and especially how the test it. In the study, we tackle topics around the whole test process, including integration testing, unit testing, versioning, GUI testing, how the build and test system is set-up, which test runner they actually use and many more. I will continue posting on this blog to share more of the results. <br /><br />\MichaelaMichaelahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08831566630451286674noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-17582679404578584762010-12-07T19:47:59.790+01:002010-12-07T19:47:59.790+01:00Hi Michaela,
nice slides. How do you feel about p...Hi Michaela,<br /><br />nice slides. How do you feel about providing more details how teams actually build their software, i.e., which features of their build systems do they actually use? <br /><br />It would be great to have a nice summary (and some instructions) how these teams perform (for instance) their integration tests, which degree of code coverage they reach, which tools they use (and how) etc.<br /><br />The big picture of "How to do QA in Eclipse" may also cover such things. Thanks and keep up working :)<br /><br />best,<br />MarcelAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04192783689046741384noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-55100209584416685182010-12-07T09:39:51.118+01:002010-12-07T09:39:51.118+01:00Thanks for the additional links and testing pointe...Thanks for the additional links and testing pointers. I added them to the original blog post.<br /><br />Yes, UI testing and UI testing tools are definitely topics worth talking about. In this post, though, I wanted to keep it more general and also vendor independent. But, you are right, UI deserves a post on its own.Michaelahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08831566630451286674noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-85220773490979567592010-11-29T09:34:19.084+01:002010-11-29T09:34:19.084+01:00Good list - I think it's important to cover UI...Good list - I think it's important to cover UI testing too. Seperating the layers of your application allows unit testing of everything outside the UI layer. I've found that Google WindowTester is probably the best alternative to SWTBot. <br />JamesJameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08468972062514207894noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-55176576309516940802010-11-28T22:29:11.050+01:002010-11-28T22:29:11.050+01:00I would add the links for "how to build a pro...I would add the links for "how to build a product" from shell/Ant:<br />http://wiki.eclipse.org/FAQ_How_do_I_create_an_Eclipse_product%3F<br />http://www.vogella.de/articles/EclipsePDEBuild/article.html<br />and how to add files to the root of yout product (interesting for testing):<br />http://help.eclipse.org/galileo/index.jsp?topic=/org.eclipse.pde.doc.user/tasks/pde_rootfiles.htm<br /><br />I did a testing environment for my app with the above links for my RCP app (includes EMF, GEF, RCP) and an SWTBot environment for the same with just building products with PDE with the approbriate product definitions and some small ANT scripts. If you are interessted, please call me the place to upload the samples.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-43531163276614522632010-11-28T15:59:37.085+01:002010-11-28T15:59:37.085+01:00Hi Michaela,
I would add "Agile Java(TM): Cr...Hi Michaela,<br /><br />I would add "Agile Java(TM): Crafting Code with Test-Driven Development" by Jeff Langr. And of course "Effective Java" by Joshua Bloch.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14028092805745206484noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-1774574219706720482010-11-04T15:18:31.875+01:002010-11-04T15:18:31.875+01:00As long as you consider the young code sort of a s...As long as you consider the young code sort of a spike, testing is optional. As soon as you are thinking of making production code, the test is not optional anymore because the test drives the design. No test -> no design.leiderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12375369195980307461noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-39330756588875084802010-11-04T15:03:27.564+01:002010-11-04T15:03:27.564+01:00This is a very good question. Still, I cannot give...This is a very good question. Still, I cannot give a concrete answer to your question, because the definition of young or the point in time when you should start testing is part of the subject under discussion. <br /><br />But to clarify a bit the term young: The youngest component would be one that is not written yet. The next point in time would be when there is already code. How much code (starting from none) should exist and how stable should that code be before you focus on testing, that is part of the discussion. Nevertheless, the proposition argues in contrast to a test first approach, thus against focusing on writing the tests before you write the code, and goes even further to argue that as long as the component is still changing a lot testing could be contra-productive. What do you think how “old”, or stable should the component be?Michaelahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08831566630451286674noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-38298483790252982972010-11-03T19:56:33.520+01:002010-11-03T19:56:33.520+01:00What do you mean with young? Hours, days, weeks?What do you mean with young? Hours, days, weeks?leiderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12375369195980307461noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8675640731803963638.post-53417335954716568182010-11-03T12:26:50.313+01:002010-11-03T12:26:50.313+01:00if you are not testing how can you be sure it work...if you are not testing how can you be sure it works? ok, for trivia it is not needed, but in the wilderness this is rare.Mr. Toschinoreply@blogger.com